Heretic and Politician: Difference between pages

Revision as of 15:35, 22 March 2023

Information

Type

Outsider

"I'm glad you asked that question. Truly, I am. But I think the REAL question here is..."

Summary

"If you were the player most responsible for your team losing, you change alignment & win, even if dead."

The Politician changes teams if they are losing.

How to Run

Examples

The Politician has been trying to execute the Demon all game, without success. With just three players alive, the Politician convinces the group to not execute, since someone is claiming to be the Mayor. There is no execution, and evil wins because a Minion was bluffing as the Mayor. The Politician wins too.

On the final day, the Politician votes for the Empath, and tells the group that the Empath is evil. The Saint is executed instead. The Storyteller judges that the good team lost due to their own actions as a group, not just the bad advice of the Politician. Good loses, and the Politician loses.

The Politician, believing that evil is winning, bluffs as the Atheist. The Storyteller is executed. Evil wins, and the Politician wins too.

On the final day, the Politician ties the vote, forcing no execution to occur. That night, the Demon kills a player, making evil win. The Politician wins too.

Tips & Tricks

Come out with a bluff on day 1, and then stick with it. Don’t deviate from your claim, don’t change up your story, remain a consistent, static source of false information, and an unfailing obstacle to the good team’s ability to piece together the truth. Claim to be an Artist who learned that Legion is in play, and force the good team to take that into account.

Bluff as extreme and ridiculous as you can! The more outlandish your bluff, the more chance that you will be the player most responsible for the loss, should the good team believe it! Pretend to be the Atheist! Pretend a Saint is your Evil Twin! Claim that you were Snakecharmed, then turned into the Klutz! Dominate the game with your crazy schemes and spread as much misinformation as possible. If the good team believes you, you can lock in a win for the evil team. Even if they don’t, the havoc you have bring may be enough to lose the game for the good team anyway.

Bluff quietly and well. Do everything you can to make sure no one suspects you are the Politician, then feed in a crucial piece of misinformation at the last possible second. Come out with a piece of false Seamstress information on the final day that frames a good player as evil, and clinch the win.

Make up some false information, and go hard after a specific player. Pretend to be an Investigator, a Fortune Teller, a Bounty Hunter, and set up another player as evil. If they’re good, this can be the deciding factor that clinches a win for the evil team. If you accidentally get the Demon killed, well, you win anyway.

Pay attention to character win or lose conditions. Then try and trigger them. If you can engineer the execution of a Goblin, or a good Twin, or a second good player in a Leviathan game, your victory is all but assured.

Make sure the Storyteller sees your efforts. Being a minor contributor to the good team’s downfall isn’t going to cut it. Make sure the Storyteller is aware that you are the player most responsible for your team losing.

Don’t rock the boat on the Outsider count. If there should only be one Outsider in play, and someone else is claiming to be the Recluse, don’t challenge them. Remain hidden, and leave the good team in the dark – that single piece of misinformation about the Outsider count could be enough to win the day.

If good seems like they are on track to win, come out. Remember, you can win with the good team too. The information you can provide – which evil players are going along with your evil schemes, who has reacted to you double-claiming their characters, that you are an Outsider - could be the piece needed to win the game.

Try and catch characters who detect alignment (but not character) in your schemes. Convince a Seamstress to check you against a confirmed good player, or a Moonchild to choose you after they die. Remember, you register as good – having you confirmed in their eyes can lead a lot of credence to your devious claims.

Have characters with powerful, single-use abilities expend them on you. Convince a Slayer to shoot you, nominate a Virgin, or convince a Professor to try and resurrect you. Make them use up their powerful abilities on a Politician, and undermine their efforts to gather information and make progress.

Tie the vote on the final day. Even if you are dead. This is MEAN, but it works! If the good team doesn't execute on the final day, and then the Demon kills that night, evil will win. To win as the Politician using this method, you will need to be the player that cast the crucial vote - if the good team accidentally tied the vote, you will lose too. Your ability says "If you were the player MOST responsible..."

Don't nominate at all on the final day if you think the other alive players are all evil. This will prevent the Demon from being nominated at all.

If a Politician is on the script and you are not the Politician, be very careful who you trust. The Politician may be in play, throwing all manner of spanners in the works, yet registering as a good player. Just because someone appears good to a character like the Seamstress, Empath or Noble, doesn't mean that you can trust them. Even if you are certain that nobody is drunk or poisoned.

Bluffing as the Heretic

When bluffing as the Politician, there are a few things you should keep in mind:

It can be a lot of fun to tease the player group, by hinting that you are the Politician without outright coming out as the Politician. By being so over-the-top, you might make other players second guess themselves. Plus, it’s just awesome being outrageous. Then maybe hint that you're the Goblin if it's on the script and make them triple doubt themselves.

If you’re on the chopping block as an evil player, claim that you’re the Politician as a way to explain away your shady or evil actions. Promise to be good if they keep you alive. And then continue to hold this threat over their heads if they don't. However, using the Politician as a back up bluff can still backfire as people might want to execute you to reduce your voting and nominating ability.

If you think good is winning, claim that you’re the Politician just to throw a massive spanner into the works. Suddenly there’s a potentially extra evil vote in play, which the group has to take into account and it puts a lot more pressure on controlling the vote.

Tell a few people discreetly that you’re the Politician, so that your shady and evil actions seem much more plausible later on. Afterwards, shamelessly nominate the Saint and try to get them executed, or try to get the wrong twin from the Evil Twin pair executed.

Tell one or two players that you’re secretly a Politician, and suggest that they can make it worth your while not to undermine the good team. Use the threat of you possibly turning evil as a way to get the good team to do your own dirty work. Nothing more fun than a cat’s paw. Direct which players the Lycanthrope chooses at night, get the good team to rat out the Poppy Grower.

Bluff as the Politician when there is already a Politician claim! This creates a lot of chaos and noise as players don’t know which player to believe. Best of all, you can lean into this nonsense by upping the stakes and gunning for the most evil action.

@@ Line 6: / Line 6: @@
 		<div id='character-details'>
-			[[File:icon_heretic.png|250px]]
+			[[File:icon_politician.png|250px]]
 			<span style="display: block; color: black; font-size: 20px; text-align: center; margin-top: 10px;">Information</span>
@@ Line 16: / Line 16: @@
 			</table>
-			<p class='flavour'>"After the hail has smashed the roof and splintered the glass of the Cathedral windows, it melts again into the earth, like a dying lamb in the desert sun. Such is the parable of the madman."</p>
+			<p class='flavour'>"I'm glad you asked that question. Truly, I am. But I think the REAL question here is..."</p>
-			<span style="display: block; color: black; font-size: 20px; text-align: center; margin-top: 20px;">Character Showcase</span>
-			<youtube>wiCHP64lW9g</youtube>
 		</div>
@@ Line 30: / Line 28: @@
 		<div class="small-12 large-6 columns">
 == Summary ==
-"Whoever wins, loses & whoever loses, wins, even if you are dead."
+"If you were the player most responsible for your team losing, you change alignment & win, even if dead."
-The Heretic turns a win into a loss, and a loss into a win.
+The Politician changes teams if they are losing.
 *
 *
@@ Line 50: / Line 48: @@
 			<div class='example'>
-				On the first day, the Heretic publicly claims to be the Heretic. That night, the Demon kills themself. Evil wins.
+				The {{Good|Politician}} has been trying to execute the Demon all game, without success. With just three players alive, the {{Good|Politician}} convinces the group to not execute, since someone is claiming to be the {{Good|Mayor}}. There is no execution, and evil wins because a Minion was bluffing as the {{Good|Mayor}}. The {{Good|Politician}} wins too.
 			</div>
 			<div class='example'>
-				The Heretic does not reveal their character until the final day, when 3 players are alive. They convince the good team to execute a good player, leaving 2 players alive, one of which is the Demon. Good wins.
+				On the final day, the {{Good|Politician}} votes for the {{Good|Empath}}, and tells the group that the {{Good|Empath}} is evil. The {{Good|Saint}} is executed instead. The Storyteller judges that the good team lost due to their own actions as a group, not just the bad advice of the {{Good|Politician}}. Good loses, and the {{Good|Politician}} loses.
 			</div>
 			<div class='example'>
-				The Heretic is dead. The {{Good|Saint}} is executed. Good wins.
+				The {{Good|Politician}}, believing that evil is winning, bluffs as the {{Good|Atheist}}. The Storyteller is executed. Evil wins, and the {{Good|Politician}} wins too.
 			</div>
 			<div class='example'>
-				The Heretic is poisoned. The {{Evil|Assassin}} kills the Demon. Good wins.
+				On the final day, the {{Good|Politician}} ties the vote, forcing no execution to occur. That night, the Demon kills a player, making evil win. The {{Good|Politician}} wins too.
-			</div>
-			<div class='example'>
-				There are 3 players alive. The Demon is executed. Because there is a Heretic in play, evil wins.
 			</div>
@@ Line 78: / Line 72: @@
 == Tips & Tricks ==
-* Keep the Demon alive at all costs. Normally, in non-Heretic games, the good team can win at any time (by executing the Demon), while the evil team can only win on the final day (by executing a non-Demon player). In a Heretic game, the evil team can win at any time (by executing the Demon), while the good team can only win on the final day (by executing a non-Demon player).
+* Come out with a bluff on day 1, and then stick with it. Don’t deviate from your claim, don’t change up your story, remain a consistent, static source of false information, and an unfailing obstacle to the good team’s ability to piece together the truth. Claim to be an {{Good|Artist}} who learned that {{Evil|Legion}} is in play, and force the good team to take that into account.
-* It is extremely dangerous for the evil team to learn that there is a Heretic in play. If the Demon believes you, they may kill themself at night, losing the game, and therefore winning the game. Be very careful who you reveal yourself to.
+* Bluff as extreme and ridiculous as you can! The more outlandish your bluff, the more chance that you will be the player most responsible for the loss, should the good team believe it! Pretend to be the [[Atheist|<span style="color:#000080;">Atheist</span>]]! Pretend a {{Good|Saint}} is your {{Evil|Evil Twin}}! Claim that you were Snakecharmed, then turned into the {{Good|Klutz}}! Dominate the game with your crazy schemes and spread as much misinformation as possible. If the good team believes you, you can lock in a win for the evil team. Even if they don’t, the havoc you have bring may be enough to lose the game for the good team anyway.
-* If you believe that the good team is losing badly, it may be safest to not reveal your identity to anyone, ever.
+* Bluff quietly and well. Do everything you can to make sure no one suspects you are the {{Good|Politician}}, then feed in a crucial piece of misinformation at the last possible second. Come out with a piece of false {{Good|Seamstress}} information on the final day that frames a good player as evil, and clinch the win.
-* Consider waiting until the final day of the game to out yourself as the Heretic. This is risky, because people may not believe you, but it’s better than having the Demon kill themself in the night and immediately win the game for evil. If you loudly proclaim that you are the Heretic when only three players are alive, even if you are dead, the good team will know that they need to execute a player that is NOT the Demon, and deliberately lose the game, which will win the game.
+* Make up some false information, and go hard after a specific player. Pretend to be an {{Good|Investigator}}, a {{Good|Fortune Teller}}, a {{Good|Bounty Hunter}}, and set up another player as evil. If they’re good, this can be the deciding factor that clinches a win for the evil team. If you accidentally get the Demon killed, well, you win anyway.
-* Search for good players who are able to confirm you as the Heretic, then work with them to orchestrate what would normally be a loss.
+* Pay attention to character win or lose conditions. Then try and trigger them. If you can engineer the execution of a {{Evil|Goblin}}, or a good Twin, or a second good player in a {{Evil|Leviathan}} game, your victory is all but assured.
-* Try to find a good player such as the {{Good|Courtier}} who is capable of making you drunk or poisoned. This will enable the good team to play for the win without fear of losing instead.
+* Make sure the Storyteller sees your efforts. Being a minor contributor to the good team’s downfall isn’t going to cut it. Make sure the Storyteller is aware that you are the player most responsible for your team losing.
-* Pay attention to characters that have win or lose conditions in their character ability, such as the {{Good|Mayor}}, {{Good|Klutz}}, {{Good|Saint}}, {{Evil|Mastermind}}, or {{Evil|Goblin}}. If you stay quiet about being the Heretic, the evil team may unknowingly be working to your advantage. For example, if the {{Evil|Goblin}} gets executed, good wins, or if an evil player is bluffing as the {{Good|Mayor}} and convinces the group to not execute on the final day, good wins.
+* Don’t rock the boat on the Outsider count. If there should only be one Outsider in play, and someone else is claiming to be the {{Good|Recluse}}, don’t challenge them. Remain hidden, and leave the good team in the dark – that single piece of misinformation about the Outsider count could be enough to win the day.
-* If you think that the good team is about to execute the Demon, you'll need to convince them otherwise. You can bluff as a Townsfolk character with conflicting information, or hint to them that executing this player is a bad, bad idea. As a last resort, reveal that you are the Heretic to dissuade them - avoiding the Demon being executed definitely results in avoiding a loss, but the Demon may or may not kill themself that night. It's better to trade a definite loss for a possible (or even, probable) loss.
+* If good seems like they are on track to win, come out. Remember, you can win with the good team too. The information you can provide – which evil players are going along with your evil schemes, who has reacted to you double-claiming their characters, that you are an Outsider - could be the piece needed to win the game.
-* When just three players are left alive, it is safe to reveal that you are the Heretic, since the game will end before nightfall. The good team may find this to be absolutely crucial information.
+* Try and catch characters who detect alignment (but not character) in your schemes. Convince a {{Good|Seamstress}} to check you against a confirmed good player, or a {{Good|Moonchild}} to choose you after they die. Remember, you register as good – having you confirmed in their eyes can lead a lot of credence to your devious claims.
-* When just four players are left alive, it might be safe to reveal that you are the Heretic, since the game could end during the night via the Demon attacking as normal. The good team may find this to be absolutely crucial information. However, there is still an opportunity for the Demon to kill themself, so be wary.
+* Have characters with powerful, single-use abilities expend them on you. Convince a {{Good|Slayer}} to shoot you, nominate a {{Good|Virgin}}, or convince a {{Good|Professor}} to try and resurrect you. Make them use up their powerful abilities on a {{Good|Politician}}, and undermine their efforts to gather information and make progress.
-* It is often smarter to never really be 100% on what you claim to be. For example, if you claim that you are either the Heretic or the {{Good|Moonchild}}, then the good team is made aware that a Heretic might be in play, and can adjust their strategy accordingly, while the Demon is not convinced enough to take the game-ending step of killing themselves. Or, if you bluff as the {{Good|Juggler}}, then claim to be the Heretic, then bluff as the {{Good|Snake Charmer}}, again the good team is clued in to the possibility of a Heretic, but the Demon isn't sure. Unlike other characters, ambiguity is your friend. Just make sure you are 100% forthright with being the Heretic when it really counts, such as the final day!
+* Tie the vote on the final day. Even if you are dead. This is MEAN, but it works! If the good team doesn't execute on the final day, and then the Demon kills that night, evil will win. To win as the {{Good|Politician}} using this method, you will need to be the player that cast the crucial vote - if the good team accidentally tied the vote, you will lose too. Your ability says "If you were the player MOST responsible..."
-* It doesn't matter if you die. If you get nominated, there is no need to defend yourself unless you want to. If the Demon kills you at night, it's no problem. Don't worry about staying alive.
+* Don't nominate at all on the final day if you think the other alive players are all evil. This will prevent the Demon from being nominated at all.
-* You hold the fate of the game in your hands. Very few characters have this power. Remember how important you are. All other Townsfolk and Outsider characters are written in such a way as to encourage you to "say whatever you want at any time", that even making mistakes won't end the game. For example, even if the {{Good|Mutant}} reveals who they are and is executed, the game continues. Even if the {{Good|Fortune Teller}} reveals who they are and dies on night 2, the game continues. But the Heretic is different. The words of the Heretic can sway the fate of the good team drastically and quickly. Even though you are an Outsider, you are the most dangerous good player in the game - to both teams.
+* If a {{Good|Politician}} is on the script and you are not the {{Good|Politician}}, be very careful who you trust. The {{Good|Politician}} may be in play, throwing all manner of spanners in the works, yet registering as a good player. Just because someone appears good to a character like the {{Good|Seamstress}}, {{Good|Empath}} or {{Good|Noble}}, doesn't mean that you can trust them. Even if you are certain that nobody is drunk or poisoned.
 		</div>
@@ Line 112: / Line 106: @@
 == Bluffing as the Heretic ==
-When bluffing as the Heretic, there are a few things you should keep in mind:
+When bluffing as the {{Good|Politician}}, there are a few things you should keep in mind:
-* Most Heretics will wait until the final day to reveal themselves. If you want to bluff as the Heretic in this way, you'll need either to stay silent about your character for the majority of the game, or bluff as another character first. Depending on the group, this type of behaviour may get you executed before the final day arrives. Minions may not fear being executed, especially as the Heretic ability continues to function while dead. But a Demon bluffing as a Heretic is risky indeed. Come up with an alternate bluff to use first - and make it believable.
-* Keep Heretic in mind as a backup bluff. If your first bluff doesn't cut the mustard, then claiming that you were lying because you are the Heretic is fairly believable. Heretics have a good reason to lie. If your first bluff succeeds, then you don't need to claim to be the Heretic, so feel free to make it a risky, ridiculous one!
+* It can be a lot of fun to tease the player group, by hinting that you are the {{Good|Politician}} without outright coming out as the {{Good|Politician}}. By being so over-the-top, you might make other players second guess themselves. Plus, it’s just awesome being outrageous. Then maybe hint that you're the {{Evil|Goblin}} if it's on the script and make them triple doubt themselves.
-* If a fellow evil player has been nominated, and you really need to keep that player alive, suddenly claim to be the Heretic, and claim that you think the group is about to execute the Demon, and lose the game. If the good team is rattled enough, especially considering that they thought the nominee was evil enough to be nominated in the first place, they may back off immediately and vote on a different player.
+* If you’re on the chopping block as an evil player, claim that you’re the {{Good|Politician}} as a way to explain away your shady or evil actions. Promise to be good if they keep you alive. And then continue to hold this threat over their heads if they don't. However, using the {{Good|Politician}} as a back up bluff can still backfire as people might want to execute you to reduce your voting and nominating ability.
-* If two evil players claim to be the Heretic, it will seem that one of them must be telling the truth, and the other evil. Normally, when two evil players both claim to be the same good character, the group will want to execute both players, believing one to be good and one to be evil. However, if the good team believes that one player is evil, and one really is the Heretic, then they may choose to keep both players alive out of fear of accidentally executing the Demon.
+* If you think good is winning, claim that you’re the {{Good|Politician}} just to throw a massive spanner into the works. Suddenly there’s a potentially extra evil vote in play, which the group has to take into account and it puts a lot more pressure on controlling the vote.
-* A real Heretic is unlikely to come out loud and proud on day 1. If you are more coy, hinting that you might be the Heretic without definitely confirming so, you will seem more convincing.
+* Tell a few people discreetly that you’re the {{Good|Politician}}, so that your shady and evil actions seem much more plausible later on. Afterwards, shamelessly nominate the {{Good|Saint}} and try to get them executed, or try to get the wrong twin from the {{Evil|Evil Twin}} pair executed.
-* Pay a lot of attention to who the good team is planning on executing. Unlike other bluffs, where if the good team believes you they will probably not execute you, if the good team believes you, they may execute you because they now want to execute good players, particularly late in the game. If the good team believes that a Heretic is in play, their strategy will reverse. Make sure this is actually what you want beforehand.
+* Tell one or two players that you’re secretly a {{Good|Politician}}, and suggest that they can make it worth your while not to undermine the good team. Use the threat of you possibly turning evil as a way to get the good team to do your own dirty work. Nothing more fun than a cat’s paw. Direct which players the {{Good|Lycanthrope}} chooses at night, get the good team to rat out the {{Good|Poppy Grower}}.
-* If you are a good player, consider bluffing as the Heretic. If the evil team believes you, they may convince their Demon to kill themself at night, winning the game for the good team! However, if there actually is a real Heretic in play, you've accidentally helped the evil team win instead. It's pretty risky! Also, bluffing as the Heretic causes a lot of confusion among the good team, as they won't know for certain what their goals are. However, the occasional good player that bluffs as the Heretic will certainly make Demon players doubt whether or not taking the risk of suicide at night is worth it, as many games are played. For the good team, Demons that doubt real Heretic claims are certainly beneficial, and this can only happen when the occasional good player bluffs as the Heretic.
+* Bluff as the {{Good|Politician}} when there is already a {{Good|Politician}} claim! This creates a lot of chaos and noise as players don’t know which player to believe. Best of all, you can lean into this nonsense by upping the stakes and gunning for the most evil action.
 		</div>